EQEmulator Forums
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

EQEmulator Forums (https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/index.php)
-   General::Server Discussion (https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=601)
-   -   Classic or era-based server content (https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/showthread.php?t=40028)

Furniture 10-08-2015 12:56 PM
Just use the takproject code if you want a classic server. No need to reinvent the wheel. If the server is just for personal use then it is perfect. A non p99 classic server with eqemulator will undoubtedly be vastly inferior to both takproject and p99.

mgellan 10-08-2015 01:01 PM
To me the Mac client is a dealbreaker, and the stated goals of the project are to emulator the Al'Kabor server not provide a progression timeline...

Regards,
Mg

provocating 10-08-2015 01:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furniture (Post 243922)
Just use the takproject code if you want a classic server. No need to reinvent the wheel. If the server is just for personal use then it is perfect. A non p99 classic server with eqemulator will undoubtedly be vastly inferior to both takproject and p99.
I would rather be shot in the foot having to use the Trilogy client, or even Titanium for that matter.

image 10-08-2015 01:38 PM
Lol for the hate for older clients, the trilogy client is not compatible with the new netcode anyway, any sort of support for trilogy would require a lot of modification.

Sounds like there are a lot of conflicting interests in this post anyhow I don't see much agreement.

AdrianD 10-08-2015 01:45 PM
I would be considered disingenuous to not show any interest.

Part of being disingenuous would be an unwillingness to compromise, which I am not.

Most here have more experience than I in many things related to this including how to proceed so, I submit to the above proposal.

Please let me know what I can do.

Thanks,

Adrian

provocating 10-08-2015 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by image (Post 243926)
Lol for the hate for older clients, the trilogy client is not compatible with the new netcode anyway, any sort of support for trilogy would require a lot of modification.

Sounds like there are a lot of conflicting interests in this post anyhow I don't see much agreement.
Someone said to use the TakProject net code. I thought they used the Trilogy client, it may have been EqClassic that was using it.

mgellan 10-08-2015 03:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by image (Post 243926)
Lol for the hate for older clients, the trilogy client is not compatible with the new netcode anyway, any sort of support for trilogy would require a lot of modification.

Sounds like there are a lot of conflicting interests in this post anyhow I don't see much agreement.
Since Milestone 1 is Classic, no matter what you're using a newer client. I actually tried to get Classic working from my original CD and couldn't get it working in anything newer than Win98SE, and my attempts to set up a VM with 3D support under Win98SE failed, the oldest Windoze with the right drivers is XP which doesn't support the old DirectX. Although thinking about it it might work under WINE!

To me there's some solid justification in using Titanium, since it works in modern OSs, and will likely do so for some time. Also, as I understand it zones like Highpass are hard coded to be the revamped zones in newer clients so there's no way to get a classic HP unless you use an older client. Happy to be corrected on this!

Also with DBG recognizing/supporting P99, I feel a downloadable Titanium client seems the most likely scenario for getting a fully legal licensed version of EQ so the barrier to entry for EQEMU is substantially lowered.

Finally with Titanium, there's a lot less crap to disable!

Regards,
Mg

mgellan 10-08-2015 03:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by provocating (Post 243931)
Someone said to use the TakProject net code. I thought they used the Trilogy client, it may have been EqClassic that was using it.
Tak uses the Mac Al'Kabor client, which is POP era AFAIK. -- Mg

provocating 10-08-2015 03:16 PM
I hear a lot of complaints with desync's, people like not liking the lack of scrolling, etc. Just saying.

Furniture 10-08-2015 03:28 PM
The takp client is fine. I box regularly on my own server with it and never had a desynch. Literally the only annoyance is not being able to mouse wheel back to 3rd person from first person. Your options are to either spend hundreds of hours learning and working to make an eqemu server classic, or to just play on the high quality, very polished Takp source code and db and deal with the first person view.

I'm just suggesting this because ive been here before. I've spent countless hours making eqemu source and database classic before takproject came out and imo it's just not worth it. I'd really recommend giving it a try because it's exactly what your looking for.

mgellan 10-08-2015 03:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by provocating (Post 243936)
I hear a lot of complaints with desync's, people like not liking the lack of scrolling, etc. Just saying.
Well considering I've put thousands of hours on Titanium on P99, it seems fairly solid. Yeah there's desyncs when you get a stupid number of people all in one zone, not sure thats anything but one of those tradeoffs you have to live with. The HighPass issue to me is what makes it mandatory. Plus of course it's been demonstrated by P99 that you can get some decent results with the client.

No sure what lack of scrolling means, mouse scroll wheel works?

Regards,
Mg

Furniture 10-08-2015 03:33 PM
Desynching is a server issue btw, it doesn't have anything to do with how good a client is

Furniture 10-08-2015 03:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgellan (Post 243938)
Well considering I've put thousands of hours on Titanium on P99, it seems fairly solid. Yeah there's desyncs when you get a stupid number of people all in one zone, not sure thats anything but one of those tradeoffs you have to live with. The HighPass issue to me is what makes it mandatory. Plus of course it's been demonstrated by P99 that you can get some decent results with the client.

No sure what lack of scrolling means, mouse scroll wheel works?

Regards,
Mg
Your confusing the p99 titanium client with the takp Pop client.

mgellan 10-08-2015 03:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furniture (Post 243940)
Your confusing the p99 titanium client with the takp Pop client.
Ah ok. What annoyed me most was the Alt key would be sticky when I flipped between boxed clients, so I'd have to hit it once each time I switched. Pretty annoying.

Regards,
Mg

image 10-08-2015 06:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgellan (Post 243934)
Since Milestone 1 is Classic, no matter what you're using a newer client. I actually tried to get Classic working from my original CD and couldn't get it working in anything newer than Win98SE, and my attempts to set up a VM with 3D support under Win98SE failed, the oldest Windoze with the right drivers is XP which doesn't support the old DirectX. Although thinking about it it might work under WINE!

To me there's some solid justification in using Titanium, since it works in modern OSs, and will likely do so for some time. Also, as I understand it zones like Highpass are hard coded to be the revamped zones in newer clients so there's no way to get a classic HP unless you use an older client. Happy to be corrected on this!

Also with DBG recognizing/supporting P99, I feel a downloadable Titanium client seems the most likely scenario for getting a fully legal licensed version of EQ so the barrier to entry for EQEMU is substantially lowered.

Finally with Titanium, there's a lot less crap to disable!

Regards,
Mg
The original disc client won't work but trilogy does. Titanium still requires modification to revert some model changes made over the years.

trilogy

http://www.eqpvp.com/images/whatsnew/charsloaded.png

versus titanium

http://www.eqpvp.com/images/whatsnew/titanium.png

Taken on windows 7 by the way.

mgellan 10-09-2015 12:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by image (Post 243945)
The original disc client won't work but trilogy does. Titanium still requires modification to revert some model changes made over the years.
I haven't had a Trilogy set for years, but they're super cheap on eBay so I ordered one to play with, thanks! Even less crap to disable! -- Mg

image 10-09-2015 12:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgellan (Post 243986)
I haven't had a Trilogy set for years, but they're super cheap on eBay so I ordered one to play with, thanks! -- Mg
Cool, unfortunately I don't think there are many public code bases you will find that support trilogy at the moment.

This first one is based on the trilogy client:
https://github.com/erfg12/EQTrilogy-Old

This is based on the mac client, but the netcode base is what you want, the opcodes and structures would have to be corrected, this requires a lot of programming knowledge
https://github.com/EQMacEmu/Server/

I am working off of my own code base which is a customized version of eqemu base back in 2k11. Still have a ways to go before Trilogy is working (zone server) on my server alongside other clients.

tramtrist 10-09-2015 12:42 PM
Nevermind we posted at the same time and you answered the question

mgellan 10-09-2015 12:46 PM
Thanks man appreciate the pointers :) -- Mg

provocating 10-09-2015 12:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgellan (Post 243938)
Well considering I've put thousands of hours on Titanium on P99, it seems fairly solid. Yeah there's desyncs when you get a stupid number of people all in one zone, not sure thats anything but one of those tradeoffs you have to live with. The HighPass issue to me is what makes it mandatory. Plus of course it's been demonstrated by P99 that you can get some decent results with the client.

No sure what lack of scrolling means, mouse scroll wheel works?

Regards,
Mg
I never said there were desync's with Titanium. I said there are desyncs with TakProject and whatever client they use.

mgellan 10-09-2015 03:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by image (Post 243987)
Cool, unfortunately I don't think there are many public code bases you will find that support trilogy at the moment.

This first one is based on the trilogy client:
https://github.com/erfg12/EQTrilogy-Old

This is based on the mac client, but the netcode base is what you want, the opcodes and structures would have to be corrected, this requires a lot of programming knowledge
https://github.com/EQMacEmu/Server/

I am working off of my own code base which is a customized version of eqemu base back in 2k11. Still have a ways to go before Trilogy is working (zone server) on my server alongside other clients.
After some poking around I discovered that EQTrilogy-old was non-working but OpenEQC actually got some code working with the Trilogy client. See:

https://github.com/randy-girard/OpenEQC

I also found a Trilogy client so I'm messing around with it. Anyone know anything about OpenEQC?

Regards,
Mg

image 10-09-2015 05:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgellan (Post 243993)
After some poking around I discovered that EQTrilogy-old was non-working but OpenEQC actually got some code working with the Trilogy client. See:

https://github.com/randy-girard/OpenEQC

I also found a Trilogy client so I'm messing around with it. Anyone know anything about OpenEQC?

Regards,
Mg
Not sure what you mean it is 'non-working'. Any person attempting to get Trilogy working is going to have to do some dev work, there isn't nearly as much work done to understand these older clients as say titanium. But this source does have the right netcode, opcodes and structures for the basics.

MarcusD 10-10-2015 01:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgellan (Post 243921)
To me the Mandate of this Project (Lets call it OpenEQ for giggles) is as follows:

"Develop and release EQEMU code, data, and quests that model the Live releases of EQ as accurately as is possible, make those releases freely available, and ensure the Community can implement working servers as easily as possible."

So here's my proposal:

- Create an OpenEQ project on GIT and fork the current EQEMU code, database, and quests into it. Or, implement someone else's code and data thats closer to Milestone 1.
- Create and host development forums and an "OpenClassic" EQEMU server
- Create a Roadmap that will track every major release of EQ starting with March 1999. Each milestone will be a release of the code, and each release will consist of code, database, and quests. So if you want to step through a complete progression, check out each milestone release, compile, load the database and install the quests. Or, hell, with a Linux server we can publish VirtualBox VMs of the complete package and serverops can just load player tables.
- All code changes need to be committed to the repository, and each milestone has a database load associated with it

Since everything is hosted on GIT, and will be freely available, no one person has control since any issues people could just start their own development fork.

So, Milestone 1 would be to build an accurate release of EQ as of March 1999.

FWIW I'm an professional server operations guy (Director level) with a development background, although my C++ is pretty rusty (15 years rusty!) - part of my reason for looking for a project is to re-engage those skills. I'm a pretty good PHP programmer tho. Most of my professional life is project management so I can add that dimension. My own server is currently aimed at modelling Velious but this to me is a more righteous project so I'd be happy to offer up my pretty recent code and database as a starting point and start moving it to Classic.

I offer up the following:

- A hosted instance of EQEMU and database to use as a main test server
- A phpBB based forum where we can interact and work out issues, post bug reports etc.
- My services to do builds of the server and deal with operational issues
- My services as Project Manager
- My services as a developer, content editor, tester

I can have the server available within a day or so. If you want to participate, great, love to have some input. If not, do your own thing. If no one jumps in, then obviously it's not a viable project. However if you jump in you commit to everything being open sourced and freely available.

Happy to adjust the above to meet the needs of the community but to me this is how to proceed. Thanks!

Regards,
Mg

PS Be quick to neither give nor take offense. Seems like we're all interested in the same goals, I'm sure we can be civil.
I'm a total noob but I think your thought of approach is little cutthroat.

How about we all do whatever we want to do, then those of us that are working towards some sense of classic (any sense) can post all our stuff to some sort of centralized host and include a readme explaining what the goal of our project is and what we did and what our future directions are?

MarcusD 10-10-2015 02:08 PM
My goal (and it is a compromised goal)

1. is to get trilogy client and corresponding source code from openEQC working using some database (whatever works).

That is milestone 1 for me.

2. Modify the database to get it as classic as possible, and remove all quests for now. (I have no idea how to work on the database would love some links for direction)

And that's it. #2 would be ongoing.

Other thoughts?

Secrets 10-10-2015 02:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by provocating (Post 243991)
I never said there were desync's with Titanium. I said there are desyncs with TakProject and whatever client they use.
Rarely are there desyncs anymore on TAK. A lot of those issues have been resolved.
Regarding this:

Quote:
- Create an OpenEQ project on GIT and fork the current EQEMU code, database, and quests into it. Or, implement someone else's code and data thats closer to Milestone 1.
It already exists, it's at https://github.com/EQEmu/Server/commits/master

You won't find anything closer to it beyond TAKProject which is also open source at https://github.com/EQMacEmu/Server

Some amount of programming effort needs to be put in by one person and not just a bunch of 'idea men' coming up with the best theoretical project. If you guys had researched why EQEmu is in the state that it is, you'd find out that it's 1) Open Source, 2) Not compatible with Trilogy due to the protocol and 3) Has a project named PEQTGC which provides an open source implementation of live.

There's a reason why P99 is closed source - it's because they are proud of their work and don't want to splinter the community that they have.

Same with EQClassic.

Instead of trying to think of the most horrible ways to 'take down the beast that is P99' - why not just create your own open source project and not care about what anyone else does, or contribute to this place which has an end goal of what you are proposing anyways.

Word of warning: You'll get people that take your code and use it if it's open source. This initially seems like what you'd want to do, as anyone can use your code and that fits your mantra. But everyone has an ulterior motive and no one is pure and you'll regret doing so.

Open source sometimes inspires a great collective of minds to come together.

But the other half of the time, it inspires a clusterfuck of jealousy and inspires idea men who ride on the coattails of greatness so they can put their experience on their job application at Starbucks.

Proceed with caution.

provocating 10-10-2015 02:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secrets (Post 244032)
Rarely are there desyncs anymore on TAK. A lot of those issues have been resolved.
Well my apologies, but the last I heard there were.

AdrianD 10-10-2015 02:45 PM
Quote:
2. Modify the database to get it as classic as possible, and remove all quests for now. (I have no idea how to work on the database would love some links for direction)

And that's it. #2 would be ongoing.

Other thoughts?
I have been working on the DB with the system I created. The system is simple and a good first step towards classic/progression content and it's EASY to customize and share progress.

I have no doubt others are doing their part with whatever system they have.

I'm glad you posted this, little by little we may actually get some shit done collectively.

Also, many will say they've made things custom and it isn't classic or blah, blah, blah. I can be the judge of what I want to use as with others.

The point is getting more accurate content not perfectly accurate content.

provocating 10-10-2015 02:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by secrets (Post 244033)
But the other half of the time, it inspires a clusterfuck of jealousy and inspires idea men who ride on the coattails of greatness so they can put their experience on their job application at Starbucks.
I have seen this, it is not pretty. I have also had people take my work and make a hideous monster of it.

Secrets 10-10-2015 02:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by provocating (Post 244035)
I have seen this, it is not pretty. I have also had people take my work and make a hideous monster of it.
This pretty much is relevant many years later:

http://wiki.eqemulator.org/p?So_You_...nage_A_Server?

AdrianD 10-10-2015 02:55 PM
Yes Secrets, we are all human.

Taking the risk to make it open is an act in humility.

That other stuff about credit and jobs means nothing to me, personally.

People can typically see through that.

Secrets 10-10-2015 03:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianD (Post 244037)
Yes Secrets, we are all human.

Taking the risk to make it open is an act in humility.

That other stuff about credit and jobs means nothing to me, personally.

People can typically see through that.
It's a risk in humility but going through 'any lengths' to keep something open that someone requests remains closed from the beginning is not making something 'open source' - that's called stealing and is not part of the open source mantra.

EQEmulator is not a community where we leak the latest and greatest programmers in the communities' work. If you want that type of community, I recommend this website: www.ragezone.com

AdrianD 10-10-2015 03:20 PM
Quote:
It's a risk in humility but going through 'any lengths' to keep something open that someone requests remains closed from the beginning is not making something 'open source' - that's called stealing and is not part of the open source mantra.
I agree.

Quote:
EQEmulator is not a community where we leak the latest and greatest programmers in the communities' work. If you want that type of community, I recommend this website: www.ragezone.com
I don't know what that is.

..................

Correct me if I'm wrong.

You seem to be describing a club with the community inside the club.

Stealing is not the intention of `many`. If `many` had the ability/time to make contributions, they would. Sure, `many2` may have no interest in contributing, this is established.

Semantics aside, this seems to be more of an issue of general outlook on things.

Those that say "let's make this work" and those that are devil's advocates.

There is a place for each in the club/community.

MarcusD 10-10-2015 03:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furniture (Post 243937)
The takp client is fine. I box regularly on my own server with it and never had a desynch. Literally the only annoyance is not being able to mouse wheel back to 3rd person from first person. Your options are to either spend hundreds of hours learning and working to make an eqemu server classic, or to just play on the high quality, very polished Takp source code and db and deal with the first person view.

I'm just suggesting this because ive been here before. I've spent countless hours making eqemu source and database classic before takproject came out and imo it's just not worth it. I'd really recommend giving it a try because it's exactly what your looking for.
Could you give a link to the takp client, source code, and database?

provocating 10-10-2015 03:40 PM
Everything you need to know is here.

http://www.takproject.net/forums/index.php

AdrianD 10-10-2015 03:41 PM
Thanks provocating.

MarcusD 10-10-2015 03:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianD (Post 243776)
Perfection is impossible.



It's easy to drop any magelo generated loottable/lootdrop. There are quite a few of the above table entries that go unused which could be matched up with a bit of work.

It's also easy to drop all items outside of an expansion if those items are labelled with an expansion - like I have done for 60k+ items - so some of the magelo gen data dropping isn't necessary.

This is what I'm basically talking about. Getting the data proper in the database is huge as everyone has said. I've made some of it so simple a caveman can help!
I have not yet graduated to caveman level but I will be helping at some point lol. I need to learn more about databases...learning how to use Heidisql would probably help ;).

AdrianD 10-10-2015 03:48 PM
Contact me bro!

It's in my selfish nature to assist people where I can so I can achieve my self-righteous goal of getting classic content?

Yeah, that's it...

MarcusD 10-10-2015 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by provocating (Post 244041)
Everything you need to know is here.

http://www.takproject.net/forums/index.php
struggling to find lol I have been there but couldn't find any downloads or whatnot.

image 10-10-2015 08:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Secrets (Post 244038)
It's a risk in humility but going through 'any lengths' to keep something open that someone requests remains closed from the beginning is not making something 'open source' - that's called stealing and is not part of the open source mantra.

EQEmulator is not a community where we leak the latest and greatest programmers in the communities' work. If you want that type of community, I recommend this website: www.ragezone.com
Lets be honest, we potentially stole EverQuest .. lol .. you know what I am talking about, lots of /zone 'ing in live with a little handy utility.

EQEmu is built more on the Cyberpunk mantra than 'just' open source.

Uleat 10-10-2015 09:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by image
Lets be honest, we potentially stole EverQuest ..

If that's the case, then they were listening more to their marketers and not to their consumer base...


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:50 AM.
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Powered by vBulletin®, Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.