Stonewall and Shielding

[trevius]

Originally Posted by KLS

I am revisiting this just to say with my next patch shielding effects will affect damage below the damage bonus or minimum hit. It will still be enforced on AC though.

That sounds ok as long as it doesn't mean the player will be getting hit for the exact same damage every time. I don't think it is right to see hits like 500 500 500 500 500 etc.

[KLS]

Nope, unless they're hitting minimum every time already shouldn't be an issue.

[ChaosSlayer]

Originally Posted by trevius

That sounds ok as long as it doesn't mean the player will be getting hit for the exact same damage every time. I don't think it is right to see hits like 500 500 500 500 500 etc.

well actualy if player AC insanly high, even with new shilding you stil ggoing to see hits like 233, 233, 233, 233 etc.
Cuase min dmg is enforced onto AC.
The diffirence that shielding will now reduce the final dmg, so it will actualy matter vs all types of dmg not just nax dmg.

in other words- the problem with identical hits is with players AC, not with the shielding =)

[trevius]

Well, I find from my testing that the problem is actually caused by the range from min and max damage if you have it set to a small 30% difference, they will almost always be hit for the min damage. But, if you set it to a big 80% difference, they will still get hit for a good range of damage.

To adjust for players with high AC, you just raise the NPC's STR up really high and it will consistently hit harder and won't be hitting for the min very often. So, if you set min to 200 and max to 2000, you would probably want to set the STR around 1500 or so depending on the AC your players should be having for that encounter. With the min being that low, players won't be hit for min very often even after factoring AC, Discs, AAs and Shielding.

My point is that adjusting shielding in the way that it sounds like KLS has planned, won't really fix the problem some admins are seeing. If they have the encounter set wrong with a small min/max difference, they will be hit for min damage every time and if they use shielding or stonewall after KLS makes the new change, I believe they player would be getting hit for the same lower than enforced min damage every time.

Server admins have to set their encounters properly for them to work right. That is why I suggested a new tool be created to help calculate mob stats and DPS vs players for the old and new combat systems (under dev tools section).

[ChaosSlayer]

the is no "problem" per say =)

there is no problem other than the one you(server admins) created themselves =)

the identical dmg hits come and will always come from MINDMG stat.
since mindmg is a damage npc will ALWAYS hit for regardless player level or ac.

KLS fix merely fixes so shielding will now also reduce mindmg not just random dmg.
but you will still get identical hits.

The only true solution to this is to set mindmg to 0 - atleast for most mobs.
Only raid bosses should have mindmg stat so they will still like a truck regardless of how many levels lower than they are.

[KLS]

Ok maybe I wasn't clear, shielding isn't calculated 100% correctly right now. I'm seeking to correct this, this isn't to address the admins that can't balance their own servers. AAs should be offering mitigation through AC mitigation, while item shielding should affect minimum damage only. All shielding was calculated in one spot, I'm simply putting them where they belong, with AAs before the min dmg check and item shielding after.

[ChaosSlayer]

just to make sure we on the same page:


curently:
dmg done cosnist of = MIn dmg (delt regardless ac) + random Dmg (reduced by ac)
100 (min) +100(random) +10% shielding= 100 + 90 = 190 dmg

10% shielding will cut of 10% of random dmg only


KLS fix will do: 10% shielding will cut of 10% of TOTAL dmg (min and random)

100 (min) +100(random) +10% shielding= 90 + 90 = 180 dmg


KLS please corect me if that is not what you mean

[KLS]

In essence shielding works like this currently:

Damage comes into the mitigation formula
We calculate our total mitigation from spells items and AAs and save it for later.
We plug our damage and mobs into the AC formula and reduce the damage.
We then do straight up mitigation from the remaining damage.
We check to see if we're below minimum hit, if we are we set to minimum hit.
Tada

How it will work.
Damage comes into the mitigation formula
We plug our damage and mobs into the AC formula and reduce the damage.
Damage mitigation from AA's is applied to the AC roll, thus adding the mitigation from damage reduced by the AC formula.
We check to see if we're below minimum hit, if we are we set to minimum hit.
We mitigate the remaining hit by item mitigation based off the minimum hit (so if you were capped at 35% item shielding and had a mob with 880 min hit it would reduce the damage by 30
We do straight up spell mitigation to the remaining damage.
Tada

I changed it to be a bit more complex but after reading lots of stuff and talking with quite a few people I believe more accurate.