Community vote

[trevius]

I think the main point that is being overlooked here is that the debate is over an issue that should be a good thing. If there is a surplus of donations, that is GREAT! I would much rather see minor issues with a surplus of donations over an issue with lacking enough donations.

Ideally, the extra cash should be put toward credit to keep the website and login server running. As long as things are paid for and running, who cares what happens to the extra?

There is no easy and clear way to deal with it. Imagine if the extra money was used to be split between the devs and mods... That would be a nightmare. How do you decide who deserves what amount? There is only 1 person responsible for paying the bill every month and as long as that gets paid, it is ok in my books.

If this whole issue is based on say 100$ not getting divided 10 ways, I think that would make this whole conflict pretty pointless. The last thing we need are devs fighting each other over 10$ a month because some think they deserve 15$. Either way, with the amount of work put into this emu, any small amount of cash that could be divided to the whole team would mean everyone is getting paid like $0.05 per hour. I am sure they can all find better ways to make money if that is the intention. Again, this whole project is volunteer based and getting money involved is sure to only lead to issues.

[cole89103]

the conflic is basicly stealing money donated for upkeep of the site and emu project and using it for their personal use if you steal petty cash from work you get fired, if you steal money from a non profit organization and use it for personal use you get fired its called misappropriation of funds its also a crime.

noone should get the money for their personal use that money is donated for the emu and the site NOT for the devs or admins personal use THAT is the issue that is at the heart of the matter, and if they ARE doing it IF I reiterate. then they should be banned and kicked off the staff

[cole89103]

not to mention if they want to get PAID they need to go get jobs as a dev not take the money from an opensource project that could be used for many other things to better the emu

[cole89103]

think about it say you donated 100 or 200 bucks and instead of that money being used for say hosting or upkeep as is stated its for it was taken by a dev for personal use...

in essance thats stealing and wrong i dont care how you slice it.

Im not saying whether its true or not however if it is then it needs to get dealt with either by getting rid of donations all together or getting rid of the people doing the stealing, OR the community needs to just stop donating

[cole89103]

i vote that this topic be closed both sides have debated admirably but i dont want anyone to feel offended or for anger to grow any further from these posts

I want to reiterate that i say neither one way or the other on it being true or not only posting hypotheticals as to what should occur if it is true

[trevius]

Well, if you read the donator's page from the main website, you will find that all of the claims so far about devs "stealing" money from the project is completely pointless.

It clearly states:

Money Donations

This page is here to provide you with information about how to donate to the developers of this project if you would like to do so. All donations are made to individual developers, not to the project itself, with the understanding that they will spend them on whatever they see fit.

You can read the entire page here:

http://www.eqemulator.net/donate.php

That sounds about as clear as it can possibly be. Apparently the cost for hosting is handled from other means, or possibly still in part from donations. Either way, it is made very clear here that donations do NOT go towards bettering the project. Other than hosting, I don't see what else donations could go towards anyway. It isn't like they need to upgrade the server or anything...

It isn't like people are being tricked or mislead into donating on the website. If someone feels a certain dev deserves a little spending cash for their efforts, then they can send them money. I don't see why there should be any sort of problem or debate around this.

Originally Posted by Scorpious2k

I think the important thing is to learn whatever lessons are to be learned, pick things up, and move forward. Now that the Scorpious2k server is coming back as titanium, I will be able to test code on it again. This means I am also back, contributing code and trying to help those who need it.

It is not a time to make accusations of real or imagined wrongs. It's a time to regroup. Refocus. Unite as a team.

Let's work together. The emulator belongs to the community. Be proud of what we have done with it, and let's keep working hard to make it better.

I couldn't have said it better myself. /cheers S2k

[cole89103]

I agree scorp..

check your pms btw

[Scorpious2k]

I think the important thing is to learn whatever lessons are to be learned, pick things up, and move forward. Now that the Scorpious2k server is coming back as titanium, I will be able to test code on it again. This means I am also back, contributing code and trying to help those who need it.

It is not a time to make accusations of real or imagined wrongs. It's a time to regroup. Refocus. Unite as a team.

Let's work together. The emulator belongs to the community. Be proud of what we have done with it, and let's keep working hard to make it better.

[Richardo]

Originally Posted by Scorpious2k

I think the important thing is to learn whatever lessons are to be learned, pick things up, and move forward. Now that the Scorpious2k server is coming back as titanium, I will be able to test code on it again. This means I am also back, contributing code and trying to help those who need it.

It is not a time to make accusations of real or imagined wrongs. It's a time to regroup. Refocus. Unite as a team.

Let's work together. The emulator belongs to the community. Be proud of what we have done with it, and let's keep working hard to make it better.

I agree with you 100%. I also agree with EQEMU Team.

[TheLieka]

Speaking as a ServerOp here:

If people have donated money to the devs for "server maintenance", etc and the servers are still running, then I don't see where the conflict is. The guys that you're calling out have spent hundreds or thousands of hours writing, and maintaining code, not to mention babysitting this community of whiners - I don't think there's any sum of money that we could scrap together that would be adequate compensation for the amount of bullshit that they've endured.

I mean, sure, bitch and moan when $10k gets donated for a server migration, then instead of a migration, the site goes dark and they're never seen again. That's an entirely different issue, but that hasn't happened.

I'm not here to lick anyone's ass, but seriously, think about it as an adult, not a child. How many thousands of dollars are we even talking about here? All these guys are grown men, I seriously doubt anyone bought a house with the donations. Who gives a shit if the community buys them a few pizzas or hookers? Anyone with a half-way decent career / life could easily see thousands in disposable income per month - I doubt the $5 and $10 donations amounted to enough to make a dent in anything. I'm just glad that everything is still working - so what if the donations didn't translate directly into hardware.

Dax

[cole89103]

its called stealing and you my friend should loose your server op status for insulting the entire community firstly, secondly you steal money out of a register at work or by any other means its still THEFT and in THIS case fraud.

As i said if they want to get paid they should quit (and so should you for your shitty ass attitude and insulting the entire community) and move on to a project in which they get paid instead of stealing money in ANY ammount i dont care if its 10k or 10 CENTS its STEALING.

Its assholes like YOU that are killing this community if WE Are such a horrible community of whiners do is ALL a favor and LEAVE!

I personally think you owe EVERY memeber of this community an appology for that insult you just slung.

Furthermore let it be stated once more that money is NOT for the dev team to go buy themselves anything it is for the EMU AND by making money off of the project they are violating copyright law by making money off of the intelectual property of Sony online entertainment...

In closing like i said if being part of this "community of whiners" then leave simple as that we dont need people who think so low of the community that amazingly keeps this project going, i got news for you if the community left you devs would have a dead project to run so show some damn respect for the community and its members

[cole89103]

oh and last i checked youve only been a server op a few days for one so you were very shortly ago a member of this community of whiners

amazing how quickly power goes to ones head

what is it they say about power and corruption?

I have a thought how about there are no titles one admin and noone else cause frankly im sick of these insulting rude people who think that because they have a title they can be assholes just for shits and giggles

I got news for you there are still rules and if you have a title you damn well should follow them as a dev and moderator of these forums

[trevius]

Troll much? LOL!

If you read the donator page which I linked above and even quoted, I already pointed out exactly how wrong you are. All donations are for individual devs to use as they like. The point of it is to allow the community a way to say thanks. It clearly states that devs can use the donations however they like. See my post above.

I admit that Dax's post was a bit abrasive, and as far as I know, he still isn't an official member of the dev team. He was given that title on the forums due to the amazing code submissions he has made to make everyone's emulator experience better. I certainly think this community would be much worse off without him, so please try to show some respect. Until you have improved the emulator more than any particular dev, I don't think you have the right to call them out on what they have done for the community.

The problem is that the people with dev titles have worked hard for them and for someone to come out of no where and try to ruin their reputation, that is just plain disrespectful, immature and bad for the community as a whole. Please try to keep your mouth shut unless you have direct proof that someone is doing something wrong. Pissing off the dev team is a quick way to ruin this great project for everyone. I certainly hope they all know to just ignore posts like this that appear to be a troll looking only to cause trouble. This is exactly when Mattmeck would normally step in and lock down the situation.

Sure, Dax was a bit rough in his post, but I am even having a hard time keeping myself composed when I read through this thread. And it takes quite a bit to get me set off. He basically said everything I have been saying, but in a less political way.

The community is made up of many smart people and I hope they are able to give this whole thing a few days and see what happens. We have lost some very valuable people in the past couple of days and I will not stand to lose more because of such stupidity. I will defend them all with every bit of my reputation (as if I have much of one) until I hear reasons not to.

Please try to show some respect. These guys already don't get the gratitude that they deserve, and they certainly don't need trolls trying to make matters worse.

I realize that you might thing you are doing the right thing posting what you are posting, but for the good of the community, please stop.

The sad part is that just a couple of weeks ago I made a post saying that this community had been drama free for quite a while, then almost immediately after, the drama started again. Here's to more peaceful times.

[mattmeck]

I wasnt going to come back and respond but I was asked to set a few things back on the correct path.

First off, money had nothing to do with my decision to quit. I made that decision based on issues that have been happening for years.

I have an issue on the forums it takes months to get any resolution because I was not trusted to have full admin power (nope had the admin name but half the admin CP couldnt be accessed). I wanted a mod on the forums, took over 2 months to get it added (the rules click mod) We had issues with spam bots, took 6 weeks to get a simple mod made to confuse the bots.

Add the fact people like cole89103 like to spout off about stuff they have no clue about (TheLieka was talking as a server OP ...server owner, didnt try to speak as a developer, so get your facts right) and I play baby sitter to a bunch of assholes, getting spammed in PM's, posts, IRC, e-mail, msn, you name it.

Then add the kicker of angelox telling me to delete the usergroups then pulling the crap he did to blame it on me and I just had enough.

I have been saying for years there needs to be more developer activity on the forums, I have been saying for years someone who was around needed access to upgrade the forums and make needed changes to the web site (I never cared if it was me, just someone needs it).

Nothing has changed, and things are getting worse, people dont bother to get the facts before spouting off and causing issues, and I got tired of playing babysitter to a bunch of elitist, demanding assholes, and not being able to see simple things get fixed.


I NEVER stated it was everyone, there is some great people in this community, 3 phone calls and about a dozen e-mails asking if i was ok (thanks to all of you, I am just getting rid of some stress).


So stop all the drama, this thread is a prime example of what had me decide to leave, this is pure crap, people trying to cause issues talking about stuff when they have no idea what there talking about.


FYI anyone can see the donations, just look at the source forge page, follow the donation link on the front page of the forums, and yes the Devs pocket it, but does that matter? it says right on the page there going to keep it for themselves, I wont lie, it would have been nice to have $ sent for me to get drunk one night after running the forums for years, but hey I am not a coder so I didnt count!