Simple Client Status

[John Adams]

I gotcha Scorp. I'll wait and see how things turn out.

As for Ueguvil, this is definitely not an Everquest client, nor it's replacement. It's a whole new game, based on similar concepts.

[Windcatcher]

Wow. Sorry for not replying yet. I've been on a weekend trip and just got back. Will read what's here and try to catch up sometime tonight. First have to get settled...

Wind

[Windcatcher]

Okay, current status. First, let me speak toward the people are very kindly testing this for me. Aside from fixing a couple of crash bugs I haven't changed the functionality of the client lately, but underneath it has undergone a MAJOR refactoring. Part of the reason for this involves licensing: SC had some GPL code in it that would otherwise be fine if I was open-sourcing it, but since Doodman and company want me to keep it closed-source all that stuff had to go. The only real casualty from a functionality standpoint was the loss of .XMI music capability, but since we don't have any of our own .XMI music anyway that's not all that big a loss. I had to move the OGRE code that I was using to read the keyboard out to a DLL, and when the client is released that will be open-sourced. Another major difficulty was the fact that I have to use a minimal amount of code from EQEmu, because SC of course has to interoperate with it. Doodman and FNW are aware of the two pieces it's using and I'm awaiting direction in that area. In my opinion, from a design-cleanliness standpoint one of those pieces has no place in any client, but I need a couple of packets to be added to the protocol to properly do away with it.

A benefit of the refactoring, though, is that later releases of SC will be WAY more agnostic when it comes to particular EQEmu server versions. Some of the problems I'm reading about aren't really problems with the client per se but the 0.5.5 server I distributed for testing. SC can talk to several EQEmu versions between 0.5.5 and 0.6.0, but there is a separate effort going on to allow it to talk to 0.7.0. This will probably take quite some time as I need someone to write a DLL for me (whistles innocently), but internally at least, SC should be much more able to talk to later revisions when the DLL eventually exists.

As far as development goes, I will definitely have to release the source to someone, as OpenZone itself is so much of a handful that I'm overwhelmed. SC is the type of project that demands a dev team, but as it's based on OpenZone's code that team will have to know something about Delphi (and have it, of course). Unfortunately, SC will probably have to remain closed source as well, as someone with a compiler could find all kinds of ways to cheat otherwise.

So what's planned for the future? I first want to get OpenZone 7.7 out the door, including somewhere between one and three mob models (definitely an orc, and possibly a skeleton or spectre). The thing's been sitting on my hard drive for entirely too long and I want to get it done. For the time being, the models that are available now are the ones that come with OpenZone 7.6, though not all models are exported to all zones. SC does support force-loading, however, so server operators do have some leeway.

I'm not overly concerned about copying the look-and-feel of EQ in terms of the GUI, as Apple lost that particular legal battle ages ago. I'm more concerned about mimicking their game system, and perhaps the client-server protocol might have to be expanded to allow for some game system flexibility (where the server DB would dictate some of the game system particulars). EQ borrows heavily from AD&D so not all that much flexibility is really needed, but at any rate such a thing would require coordination between both the server and the client.

[Teppen]

Definately would like to see some undead mobs. Id like to see a zombie version of your models. Something like having rotting flesh covering all the body except from one elbow down to hand being of a skeleton model and from one kneecap down to foot being a skeleton model. Maybe left arm and right leg or vica versa. Maybe one side of chest rotted flesh and the other side exposed ribs of skeleton model. Maybe head of a zombie but with jawbone of skeleton model. Maybe skin (rotted flesh) as greyish green. Dunno if you could weave your skeleton model with a zombie model but I think it would be cool additon to your undead release in OZ 7.7. Just shooting out ideas, not asking any requests as I know your busy.

One question I have about simple client, is it recognized by the official eqemu loginserver or does it require its own login server?

[Dralanna]

While I greatly appreciate the work this involves and look forward to it's results, I have to ask if this is intended as a replacement for Titanium? (ie. No further support for EQ Clients?) For me (and I'm sure for many) the fun of the Emu is in reliving what was on live... or seeing things I never got to on live. If this new client wont be able to use original EQ content we lose the nostalgia factor. So basically the question is: will the servers development continues to support Titanium in addition to this new client or will Titanium support be replaced by the new client?

[Windcatcher]

Well, GeorgeS' spectres are done. I finished rigging and animating them yesterday. If you'd like to see more models, perhaps you should ask him

I doubt that SC will ever replace a live EQ client but that's really a question for the server devs. My client is just a separate option for people who don't have a compatible live client (with obvious differences, e.g. no SOE content). The official EQEmu login server does recognize SC, though the protocol is entirely different and SC connects to a different LS port for it. The protocol will likely change as we still need to implement client version authentication somehow and I'm awaiting direction from Doodman and FNW on how they would like to handle it. Otherwise, the LS protocol that SC uses is entirely our own invention.

[John Adams]

Originally Posted by Dralanna

While I greatly appreciate the work this involves and look forward to it's results, I have to ask if this is intended as a replacement for Titanium? (ie. No further support for EQ Clients?) For me (and I'm sure for many) the fun of the Emu is in reliving what was on live... or seeing things I never got to on live. If this new client wont be able to use original EQ content we lose the nostalgia factor. So basically the question is: will the servers development continues to support Titanium in addition to this new client or will Titanium support be replaced by the new client?

I tried asking this question, and in general was told the EQ of old is not supported. I do not see how SC can zone me into ecommons and see the SOE-specific info unless the server admin provides that content - which will be going against the entire philosophy of SC (i think).

I had asked somewhere if there might be (unsupported) tools for converting SOE content to SC-compatible, and that answer was a resounding "no".

I doubt the devs will cease development of EQEmu for normal EQ clients - but perhaps a branching will occur that keeps the 2 server projects seperate.

[Windcatcher]

As far as I know it should be possible to keep a single server source tree that can accommodate both the live client and SimpleClient, though SimpleClient will eventually allow for a much broader set of features that the live client cannot support. I would still expect server devs to support the live client, certainly for the time being, though if SC gets the developer support I'd like to see it get perhaps the live client will eventually become unnecessary.

I suppose if someone wanted to recreate SOE zones with OpenZone it's possible, though I would find that disappointing. Even though a recreation may still be legal if free content, models, textures, etc. were used (and if the zone names were changed), the entire point of OpenZone was to allow players to experience worlds beyond what Norrath offered, that is, to bring back the thrill of discovery (without something like Allakhazam to tell them where everything is before they even get there).

As an update, I've completed rigging and animating two of GeorgeS' skeleton models, though using them will necessitate a tiny update to SimpleClient to make them practical. I'll see if I can get something out to Cavedude this weekend (or perhaps before). I'll also see if I can fix at least one or two of the bugs people have mentioned (a stickied SC bug thread might be especially useful going forward so I don't have to sift through pages and pages of threads to hunt them down).

[John Adams]

Originally Posted by Windcatcher

(a stickied SC bug thread might be especially useful going forward so I don't have to sift through pages and pages of threads to hunt them down).

I'm still pushing for an entire SimpleClient category here with forums to support General, Support, Bugs, Fixes, and Development. Not sure if an Admin has gotten to that yet, or plans to.

[CrabClaw]

I think this is a great idea and would love to help make zones for it. I would rather use Blender though its free to anyone and its plenty powerful once ya learn it.

Did you guys look into Raknet for the internet suff, or even Crystalspace? I have compiled a lot of both of those libraries and demos and they are pretty handy.

I would love to see the project go open though as I like to compile my own binaries and possibly contribute to the database.

Do you have a beta SQL schema setup?

[cubber]

Any plans on making a linux client, if not will SC be wine compatable?

[Windcatcher]

I'm not making any effort at a Linux client as SC is written in Delphi. Has anyone tried it under Cedega?

[cavedude]

SC works perfectly with Cedega for me.

[Windcatcher]

A new beta of SimpleClient has been posted to cavedude's FTP.

Program changes:
- Fixed some engine lighting bugs
- Changed the way that OpenZone exports placeable objects to XWF files, and the client has had to change as a result. Also, the change meant that I had to re-export all zones, and so you must download them. This is definitely the better way to handle it, though.
- Fixed a bug in spawning doors.
- When you select a mob, the name above it will flash.
- Fixed mob animations (sitting, standing, looting, etc.)

Content changes:
- Aside from re-exporting all zones due to bug fixes, Lelembeth has undergone some MAJOR additions. The city is now much more complete, and I've added a druid ring and a rocky area to the west. Go do some exploring...
- Added GeorgeS' Type I skeleton model, prefix SKE, race 60, to the global creatures file. You can spawn them in any zone you like. This model has two body types.
- Added GeorgeS' Type II skeleton model, prefix SKF, race 401, to Lelembeth. This model has four body types.
- Added GeorgeS' spectre model, prefix SPE, race 85, to Veldona. This model has four body types.

A lot of files have changed, so make sure to get everything dated today.

Wind

P.S. I can also post my DB as mine has mobs and doors spawned in Lelembeth, but I don't know if cavedude has been changing his DB. Let me know if you want mine.

[John Adams]

I'm still very interested in testing this for you guys, I just have little to no time again... but I'll try and squeeze some in. Do you know if the char select issues have been resolved from a month or so ago?